London Fixed-gear and Single-speed SJS Cycles

Hi all,

I am trying to decide how feasible it would be to (catch the train to calais) and then ride across france and into switzerland with a friend this summer. the route is 850km and i would aim to do just over 200km per day on the first part which is almost totally flat, and then a bit less in the second, shorter part, which is quite hilly, as you get into switzerland. Have people done much riding in France before?

how much milage did you do per day?
how was the cycling in france on the d roads?
how much crap would i have to bring and would a bag get too uncomfortable?
where would be the best places to stay 'en route'?
is it totally ridiculous to want to do it fixed (perhaps on a flip flop hub with an 18 tooth cog on one side and say a 22 tooth freewheel on the other)?

thanks for your help!

L

I did this exact route with Krzys 3 years ago. Except we rode to Dover. We did 950km in 5 days. We were both pretty fit, but that still added to 10 hours at least riding each day. For a more comfortable experience I would aim for 100 - 150k a day.

I recommend you get a 1 200 000 and a map-holder. That way you can plot and follow a quiet lane route, and stay off the long, straight and fast highways. We stopped at Cambrai, Verdun, Remiremont, rode across Ballon d'Alsace and into Basel.

I can send you a rough outline of the route we took, but are you planning tents or hotels? It makes a big difference. North Eastern France is pretty empty once you get away from the major towns, there is nothing. Especially in August. On the way to Verdun, me and Krzys didn't see a single open hotel for 100k. And believe me, if we had seen one, we would have stopped!

Don't even think about taking a bag, at least not one you carry on your shoulders. Me and Kryzs had a trailer, a big messenger bag each and swapped the trailer over between us.

Forget it being flat - just cos there aren't any hills over 300m doesn't mean it's flat - it's up and down the whole way until you get to the Vosges. Each little rise is nothing, but taken together they add up to a lot of effort. I don't think we had more than 1k of flat the whole way (apart from when we finally arrived in the Rhine valley.

RIding it fixed? If you are really fit, yes, why not? If you aren't really fit, forget it. I pulled the trailer over Ballon d'Alsace (I think I was towing maybe 20 -25 k) and I ran out of gears, even with 39-32.

And finally, that ride was one of the best experiences of my life. And Krzys said one of the funniest things that anyone's ever said to me: after 260k from Cambrai to Verdun we were on our hands and knees. And our arses were RAW. Krzys summed it up by saying: My arse feels like I have been fucking with 1000 monkeys...

I've not ridden much in France but I've been there many times and pedalled about occasionally, and...

Of course it's feasible, it's a great idea. Cycling in France is great, they are a nation of cyclists and very used to them. Everywhere you go you'll see people buzzing around on bikes, usually in full lycra and all the gear. They do, of course, drive like maniacs but that's not too much of a problem.


How much crap you carry depends on where you stay (eg hotels/b+b vs campsites). In general it's best to carry as little as possible. It's all too easy to find yourself with 15kg of gear and that's just change of clothes, essential tools, a lock and not much else. As soon as you're carrying gear you'll be doing much shorter distances. If you look at seasoned Audax riders they carry almost nothing, usually in a saddle bag, and almost never have racks or panniers.

If you're camping you'll be going slower, unless you do extreme camping, because you'll be carrying a tent, stove, sleeping bag, mat, etc, etc. Don't even think about wearing a bag on your back. Keep everything on the bike, that's what it's there for.

Doing it fixed is fine if you want. Then again, if you're going to Switzerland you may want to enjoy the downhills they have, which are nothing like anything you'll see in UK.

Oh, and - yes, it's flat in much of France but French flat is nothing like London flat; it's long, slow uphills and long, slow downhills.

Yeah, when touring I'd do 80-160k a day, usually around 100k.
You need to navigate and you'll want to stop to eat and look at stuff and sort things out like mechanicals and your accom as well as cleaning yourself and washing kit, etc. (I stayed in a tent, b&b's and hostels depending on where I was)

I used a geared mtb with rear panniers. No chance with just a bag.
Accom. will depend on your budget and what you can/want to carry. If you are up for loaded touring then you can carry a tent, mat, sleeping bag, etc. If you are not, then you will carry a credit card and stay wherever you want to stop (this coudl get costly though).

Gears are nice for such distances.

Having maps BEFORE you start out will also help a great deal.
There are loads of options depending on how much kit you have, your bike options, etc.
Do you have any bikes that will take a rack and panniers? DO you want to buy/borrow a trailer? etc/

thanks bill, hippy and mdja

for planning routes there is a website called Bikely which is very helpful. we are aiming for geneva - i have a fair idea of which towns i want to see / have a look around and so on. i'm probably going to be doing a route a bit south of yours

we will be staying in hostels / b&bs or hotels - i like camping but we want to keep the things we have to bring to a minimum and make the cycling reasonably speedy

so panniers are a bit of a must then? i can fit a pannier on my fixed wheel bike if i want. i'm fit but after reading about the flatness, i'm thinking that it wouldn't be quite as enjoyable as i had imagined. so maybe buying a second hand geared racing bike on ebay then selling it when i get back would be a plan

bill: hahaha - bibs with a good pad crucial then?

how are the d roads for cycling, safety wise?
which would be the best / quickest way from london to calais?

http://www.bikely.com/maps/bike-path/163894

sounds cool. in fact, sounds brilliant.

i'm getting an audax bike for light touring. i think i may plump for a condor agio, but i'm not sure. i don't really want a full-on tourer, but need a rack and rear triangle capable of carrying 10-15kg.

i noticed dawes do an audax bike as well. the joy of gears for rides like this is the potential for rest - don't underestimate it.

I think 200k on flat terrain is possible but you'll not really have time to stop when you fancy or enjoy a long, lazy French lunch. I'd definitely advocate gears too, as PJ says do not underestimate the opportunity to rest.

Choosing what to take is worth spending some time on - you can rest assured that the first time you go on a trip you'll take stuff you'll never need. Over time you begin to pare back the load to the point where you can fit all you need in one of these. Grow a beard and get some SPD saddles and you'll soon be eligible for CTC membership. ;)

For light(ish) weight camping gear check out Decathlon in Surrey Quays. Went there today and picked up all the stuff we need for camping for a reasonable price.

Again, depending on what you need to carry, you could get away without panniers and use one of those seatpost-mounted racks+bags or perhaps handlebar bag + rear carradice bag.. something like this setup:
http://www2.arnes.si/~ikovse/weight.htm
It's referred to as "credit card touring".

Be careful buying a new bike. You'll want to give a new bike a VERY GOOD test ride before purchasing and then you'll need a lot of miles on it before using it for touring.. unless you want the trip to suck because you're in a world of pain.

I don't remember having any trouble in France with cars. They were much nicer towards cyclists than Australian drivers or UK drivers.

You don't need bibs w/ pads but I'd certainly suggest some form of proper padded cycling shorts.
These are the best (and prob. most expensive) shorts you can get:
http://www.awcycles.co.uk/brands/Ass...410/index.aspx

Ribble do a cheap winter/audax frame which I used as my only road bike until I bought the S-Works. Slacker than race geometry, guards will fit, rack mounts, cheap, heavy. Basically it works but it ain't flash:
http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/catego...neraudax-11764

+1 on the Assos mille shorts. Have the bibs. The pad is enormous.

Luggage - personally I wouldn't use handle-bar mounted stuff (apart from a map-holder which is absolutely essential!) or anything on the front-wheel. Have a look at the Carradice under-saddle bags. If you are serious about travelling light, then I think those might do for you - and they won't affect the front-end handling in the way that h/bar bags do.

+2 F1 Mille shorts. I was wearing those for the tour, with a cheaper pair over the top, but still ended up hurting like hell.

I wouldn't bother riding to Dover. To get a nice route, we ended up going Sevenoaks and south of Ashford, looping around over the A20 and coming in through the North Downs. 170k or something.

i've done some credit card touring on a geared bike around normandy. lovely roads, 150 kms per day was comfortable for me. plan your route around prevailing winds, if you can.

Am based in Basel now and would say doing that route on a fixed even with optional granny gear freewheel would get painful - there are hills here and by the end you are not going to want to be flipping your wheel round at the top of every hill. Though having said that if you are super fit there is nothing to stop you (ride a 48 * 16 for commuting/shopping/exploring and there are no impossible hills - but not sure I would still say that after a weeks solid riding though).

French drivers have a bad rep here but that is in comparison to the Swiss (when using pedestrian crossings if you see French number plates advice is to wait and move away) but they are still better at being considerate to cyclists than is the norm in the UK - compared to London it's bliss.

A mate has maps of here which are quite good (show road sizes inverse to what is normal - smaller/quieter roads are bigger while motorways are barely noted) which are great for cycling - will have a look if I can find a web link and if they cover France too.

well i just got back from the trip, decided to go in the off season to save money on b&bs. Did about 80 miles a day for the first 3 days, then dropped down to about 60 for a couple of days then back up to about 70-75 for the last few. It took us 7 days of cycling to get from calais to lausanne and was amazing, i cant recommend it enough to anyone. I did the first 3 days fixed and then the rest on freewheel - my friends went on geared bikes, which they enjoyed though it is easily done on ss - though we went through the jura region near switzerland avoidong any ridiculous climbs.

cheers for all your advice, made the trip really

and advice from me to others: avoid the roads on the aube department, they are shit and also, avoid having to go near large towns that you dont want to stop in, you will almost certainly waste an hour getting lost and trying to avoid getting thrown onto dual carriageway.

Ok so once you've got your bike and kit, how much does this cost? Could you give me a rough idea of what the money went on? cheers

I'm thinking of going through france to somewhere, maybe over 2 weeks? next summer

hmm. well i was travelling with two friends which made accomodation problematic at times as not all small b&bs had rooms for 3 people so occaisionally it was more expenisive. We paid around 20 euros a night and about 40 once when we were beached in a touristy type place. we were off season (start of september) so got cheaper sometimes. then we probably paid around 10 euros a day for food. next time i do a trip like this i will book ahead (i didnt as i had no idea what mileage we were capable of) and consider camping.

cheers for the help. I think i'd want to do it camping so hopefully that would be a bit cheaper

man... I really want to go on a bike tour! If anyone has any ideas I'm here! :)

a idea for a long trip........ the danube cycle way?

:-)

i cycled from paris to barcelona. great fun, accept for spain. they hate cyclists.
we did about 70 miles a day

Please tell me more about this - my next imaginary planned tour is UK to Malaga so any info on cycling in Spain would be appreciated...

has anyone taken the route to frankfurt? a friend and i were thinking of doing it this summer...it is quite a distance and will probably take about 5 or 6 days. Just wondered if anyone knew what the accomm was like such as camping areas/hostels (hotels/b&bs if it is the only available.)

France is really nice to cycle through. A few summers ago i did Calais to St Malo over about a week. Basically riding for about 8 hours a day by myself. As soon as it started to go twilight, i would just stop at the next campsite i came to... which was only ever a few Km's away.

Looking to ride europe again this year if people fancy getting together and doing a group ride.

Edit - Did this on an old peugeot that i had equipped with a combination of deore and 105. With the smallest pannier bags i could find, tent and sleeping back on top and tent poles along the top tube.

I didnt plan a route before hand, still didnt know where i would be headed when i was on the ferry. Best way to do it i feel. I started heading in a general paris direction, ended up taking a wrong turn which took me west rather than south and spent the next few days cycling along the coast of normandie buying michelin maps along the way.

Im cycling back from switzerland (via calais to london) in two weeks any recommendations on routes, town to avoid / pass through cheers

towns to avoid: troyes - its impossibly sign posted, the area around troyes has generally shit roads as well, so i'd avoid it!

i don't know what route your planning on taking but i very much recommend the jura mountains, maybe head towards chapagnole, then salins les bains and up through the foret de chaux is an awesome bit of cycling

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...=h&z=9&iwloc=A

thanks leo ill check it out

Info so far has been great to read, I'm cycling from paris to montpellier two weeks today. Has anyone here been on such a route before? If so any pointers would be great, also... there are so many maps to choose from! I noticed a reccomendation of a 1:200 000, anyone able to give a link to a map they used?

(We are doing this geared w/panniers :) )

Michelin maps are very good. They do a 1:150000 range which show the minor roads in better detail than the 1:200000 range. You can get them from Stanfords on Long Acre in Covent Garden.

Are you going to head south west from Paris or head towards Lyon and then down the Rhone valley?

it would mean a little detour but i'd recommend riding along the river from Millau to Albi. Takes you down a beautiful gorge with high cliffs/ hills on each side with stunning views over the river.

Also takes you under the Millau viaduct (tallest vehicular bridge in the world)...

....is what we are planning to do.

We only really started looking yesterday so if there are any big suprises you know of, please let me know ... !

We are staying for a week just north of Montpellier in a family friends holiday home in a quiet historic town....typical that they are the 'traditional english' type and have no ideas for us... :(

wow, that place looks amazing. inspiring photo!

Yeah. The place is really amazing!
Congrats for this trip.. It might not be easy..
You guys rock

hey, I dont know if you've left already so this may be no use.

But I just cycled 500 miles through france. We caught the eurostar to paris, cycled to Dijon, then Limoges. We camped sauvage and it is totally possible - I worried I wa being a bit naive in thinking that there would be places to sleep off the beaten track, but there was. The best thing to do is look for water as you can generally find unused bits of land, and you can have a wash as well.

We couldnt have survived without tents, sleeping bags, cooking stuff, deodorant, several padded shorts, eco shower gel, toothbrush and paste, waterproofs, map, zip ties, pump, repair kit.

You DONT need to bring 3 summer dresses, more than 2 t-shirts, make-up, felt tip pens
( I learnt the hard way)

Hi there, Haven't left yet! Flying on wednesday next week! How was the cycling out of Paris? And also, the route to Dijon?, as we are taking similar starting route just south of your course heading to Lyon.

We actually changed our minds from B&B'ing to camping last weekend. We have brought our tent but hadn't considered the idea of camping sauvage. I'm guessing its legal? Because waking up to the police would be a pain! How easy was it to find places suitable.

Cheers

Yeah, well easy!! I was surprised- like I said, look for water, or signs that say "plan d'eau." Yes, it is legal, you need to be a certain distance away from the road, and from houses, not sure how far exactly, but its pretty obvious stuff.

They also have a lot of picnic areas by the sides of roads. You can camp there, and cook on the tables.

Route to Dijon was mostly flat til the last 100 K.

Paris was fine- oh, but I'd suggest bringing a compass, so that you can head south to get out. We headed to Orly airport. There is a road that run through some dodgyish areas but runs parallel to the motorway. Dont go on the motorway. If you map has an "E" road, thats a motorway - dont go on it!

Any more questions feel free to PM me.

Good luck and post pictures!!
Anna