The last couple of months I've been riding a lightish weight carbon fibre road bike, I was training for a sponsored ride down to Lands End and would just never have made it up the hills on a fixed and in the unlikely event that I had would have crippled my legs on the way down.

Anyway want to get back to commuting on a fixie but having been spoiled riding the Pedal Force can't face getting back on the Langster, I'm not knocking them but they're rather heavy.

I'm not trying to put together something super elegant and beautiful (though that would be nice) just something light and sprightly, problem is I've already spent way too much on bike projects this summer so need to do this fairly economically.

I’ve got a selection of spare bars/stems/seatposts and other bits of finishing kit to play with, a rather nice Profile carbon fork (with 1” steerer) and have some Miche track wheels I can use until I can build something more appropriate. So I need a frame, I’d prefer steel and double butted rather than straight gauge, I’m trying to keep this as light as possible.

An obvious choice is to go for one of Fuji’s steel track bikes, immediately swap out the fork and upgrade the other bits to lighter kit as I pick bits out of the spares box/find stuff I like. This begs the question how heavy is the base frame the Fuji is built up from? Anyone got any ideas? How would it compare to the frame of the Bianchi Pista or Lemond Fillmore or something like a Fixie Inc. Peacemaker or a Pake or an IRO?

I like the idea of a Soma Rush, but think it’ll be hard/expensive to find one this side of the Atlantic. I’ve thought about a Pake or an IRO but get the impression that they’re rather heavier than the Soma Rush or Fixie Inc. Peacemaker I’ve also been considering.

Anyone got any ideas about the relative weight of the Fuji frame or suggestions about any other frames I haven’t thought of? Thanks.

Argon 18 Electron

http://www.argon18bike.com/en/electron.htm

You will need to swap the fork if you want to run a front brake.

It looks gorgeous and would've expected it to cost more than the rrp of £549, but that's still more than I was aiming to spend on this particular project. I'd also be terrified of leaving it anywhere, even locked up, so would be problematic as a commuter. I want something sweet and lightweight but neither too expensive or too flash, may be an impossible combination to acheive. Thanks for the suggestion though.

So, you want it strong (steel) light and cheap.

As they say, strong, light, cheap - choose any two !


;)

Yeah, but I want all! And I want it know!! And I want it cheap!!!

And you shall have it all.

Strong, light and cheap = click!

OK, got it !

£450 squid including delivery (complete bike), lightweight (ish) at a claimed 20lb for the whole bike, but comes as a single speed not fixed (has a freewheel) but 5 minutes of welding at your local mechanic would solve that (!)

http://altabikes.no/

i just bought an iro frame to replace my eai barenuckle that got crash damaged. i havent tried it out yet but frame weight seems ok not as light as the eai and the forks are quite heavy.
but the price is good.

LOL, those things are a joke

ANOTHER broken 'knuckle!??

[quote] RPM:What's the deal, I don't know anything about them, are they badly made ?

you can get a soma frames from mosquito bikes up on essex road, islington,
rush is £360 assume thats frame and forks.
they also do the delancey, which has some really nice lugging and a slightly more relaxed riding position (so it says on the website)
not sure on how long you'd have to wait for delivery, give them a ring to find out when their next order is going through

http://www.mosquito-bikes.co.uk/htdocs/soma.php?name=bikes#

how many have there been??

[quote] leeww:we saw one in the flesh yesterday.

Ikea bike.

except not particularly cheap or useful

your's,
Imoncrank's
LPG's


there's only mine and the smiling buddha's left, so far as I know (on this forum)

Oh go on !!! Spill the beans, what is it that is bad about them ?

Are they badly made ? Crap paint jobs ? Much heavier than the claimed 20lb ? Poor welds on the frame ?



Cheeeeeers.

Lee

didn't someone say a pompino frame is only a couple hundred notes. (£149)
http://www.on-one.co.uk/index.php?module=pagemaster&PAGE_user_op=view_page &PAGE_id=5&MMN_position=4:4
the fuji track frame would be marginally lighter than the bianchi pista, as it has small tubing all the way around.

there is a nice half built track bike on ebay atm, £265 'buy it now' ?!!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Omega-track-frame-carbon-forks-165-cranks-tri-bars_W0QQitemZ110162382113QQihZ001QQcategoryZ33503 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Lee, re the altoid or whatever it's called:
I don't know about the weight, but the geometry and componentry isn't really serious (I would say in my opinion, but at least another five people all held similar views)

The bike is the product of the collaboration between graphic design, furnitue design and advertising agencies



other than that, go look at one, make up your own mind.

What are these like?

Soma Rush can be had from Mosquito Bikes for err.. £350 or so. 1" head tube, lightish, stiff, nice.

I don't quite understand the lightness thing.. for London commuting or are you elsewhere? There's no hills here.

Alu, bars as wide as a house, only available in 54cm and 58cm, advertised with a naked guy and it's going to get you more sh1t for being a bandwagon jumping poser than all the langsters put together! :)

I had a look at the website and I see your point, I love the way they describe the wheel set in such precise detail - "700x25" - and that's it !!

They don't bother with such details as what the hubs are, what the rims might be, the spokes, the cranks, the BB etc

Most probably a cheap frame, nicely painted with a heap of crap glued on by the looks of it.

:)

at least the langsters are actually designed by bicycle designers, with all the back-up and experience of a leading manufacturer.


the bloke in the advert has those big thighs because he has to walk up the stairs at the tube station (escalators always broken) every day. Cos that bike ain't gonna get ridden

I will give the Alta one vote: At least it's not another fscking sub-£100 dual-suspension "mountain" bike!

For 300 quid you can get a Bob Jackson, which are both pretty and fast.
http://www.bobjacksoncycles.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=28&products_id=307

Really a lot depends on what you're after. There aren't that many off-the peg frames which are cheap and decent. Once you start worrying about the weight, well then the price starts rising.

The Langster is still going to be lighter than most cheap steel frames, so to get something lighter you'll be getting out of the cheap tubeset market and into the nice stuff (or dropping coin on components).

For the Rush/Fuji/Jackson money (esp if you just want a frame) then you could get something lovely 2nd hand, if you know what you're after.

In answer to Hippy the Pedal Force is just brilliant, it's a ZX3 and the first seriously exotic road bike I've ever put together and I'm astounded by what a difference it makes. First time I rode it into work instead of the (not particularly heavy) steel ribble I was commuting on at the time I literally cut my journey time by nearly 10 minutes. I used to get from Croydon to Trafalgar Square in 45 minutes, first day I used the Pedal Force made it in in 36 minutes, over the summer I was fairly consistently doing the journey in 30 minutes, I'm sure there are fitter speed merchants out there who could do it faster, but for me that was pretty impressive. In preparation for the ride to Lands End I did a lot of hill training around Dorking and again was quite surprised by just how stable and comfortable the bike was on fast steep descents.

I want to commute on a fixed again but having experienced what a difference a lighter bike makes and just how much more fun it is to ride I want to try and get that in my fixed ride as well.

Someone at work actually commutes in on one of those "fscking sub-£100 dual-suspension "mountain" bikes" I've told her it's more of a pogo-stick than a bike and she's gradually coming around, plan to put an old Raleigh Twenty together for her. While I’ll agree the Alta is better than one of these that’s not exactly a glowing recommendation, fraid I’m going with those that say it’s rather crap and will be steering well clear.

If the Fuji in standard form is just nominally lighter than the Langster I'm tempted to give it a whirl and lighten it up by rebuilding it using kit from my spare bits collection, I like that it doesn't come with brakes, so I can put a decent set on without having to chuck a brand pair of el cheapo ones.

If the Fuji is comparable in weight to the Langster (or heaven forbid heavier)then I'll probably steer clear and try something else. Thanks to everyone who's reminded me that Mosquito sell the Soma Rush, but with it selling for £360 I'm tempted to instead go for the Fixie Inc. Peacemaker from Hubjub for £295, just as long as it isn't (significantly)heavier. I like the lugged chrome fork this comes with, it'd suit another project I have in the pipeline. Also spoke to Cavendish Cycles, sounds like they've got some IRO Anguses (is that the plural of Angus?) on the way, that would fit the bill, except they don't take a rear brake and I still feel safer riding with one in town. Just to show how undecided I can be also thinking of going for an EAI Brass Knuckle, only problem is I think I'd have to get it sent over from the states as emailed Hubjub and they only import the Bare Knuckle. Again I'd have to make sure this frame was lighter than the Langster or I'd be wasting my time and money. I'll keep you posted with how this develops and post a picture in names and faces to bikes once it's done. Would still welcome suggestions about any frames/options I haven't thought of.

That Alta bike thing is the whole bike, which is not too bad for £450.

That's a ~20k journey isn't it? In 30min? You're sh1tloads faster than me.

Comparing the Alta with sh1tty Halfords bikes certainly wasn't a recommendation for it.

I've been talking with one of our club members (heavier build, ex-trackie, similar to me) and he's gradually allaying my fears of full-carbon frames. Offered his for a tester.. hehe little does he know...
Nowadays, I'm not racing, so I don't reckon there would be any reason to avoid carbon in favour of the ("perceived" to be) stiffer and more crash-durable aluminium jobbies.
Almost every fecker I ride with has a carbon bling machine that comes out for nice weather. I'm jealous. I want a cyclefit and then I'm going bike p0rn shopping.. Options open as always :)

Peacemaker: 1800g (not sure which size or if it includes fork, etc)
Charge Plug: 2500g, Fork 912g (not sure if that's included in frame weight)
Langster: 1587g (conversion from 3.5lbs) (again not sure what's included or frame size specified)
Surly Steamroller (56cm): 2010g, fork 916g
On-One Il Pompino (54cm): 2150g, fork 843g
Pearson Touche (56cm): 1720g, fork 577g
Dolan FXE (58cm): 1920g, fork 620g
IF Steel Crown Jewel Track Frameset: 1620g
Soma Rush: 1814g (frame only)

Thanks for the info Hippy, I'd never have the Langster frame was that light, I may have to go back and look at the bits it fitted with and see where the weight is? Thanks for mentioning the Pearson, I'd forgotten about them.

One thought worth sharing about the whole carbon fibre bike thing is the issue of just how much easier it is to crush damage carbon bits by over tightening things, the other thing I wasn't expecting was to have the (carbon fibre) seat post get all bound up in the seat tube, I got it out eventually but it made all sorts of scary noises and the friction made the frame get perceptibly warm to the touch all around the seat tube/top tube area, that was scary! I ended up working it out a couple of millimeters, then leaving it 15-20 minutes to cool down before working it out another couple of millimeters.

If I can afford it (and it won't be for at least several years) next time I'll got for a frame with titanium main frames but a carbon fork and rear triangle, something like the Seven Cycles ID8, well we can all dream can't we. I still love the Pedal Force but the whole carbon fibre seat post stuck in carbon fibre seat tube and making very scary squeaking noises coming out has heightened my anxiety about carbon fibres long term strength/reliability.

poly as a possible alternative how about this.
titanium track bike for about £225, add in 30 or so quid for shipping and another sixty odd on this end for customs charges ands you could have a titanium track frame for under 400 smackers.
frame weight is 1520g
I brought one of these frames from this guy off ebay, took a while to arrive, but the frames in perfect nick and I've spent the last couple of months buying bits for it. Still not finished but I'm dying to get it done and to start riding it.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Titanium-Tracker-bike-frame-AeroTi-Brand-New_W0QQitemZ190146065589QQihZ009QQcategoryZ2904QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I swapped out the full-carbon fork on the Soma for an alu steerer one for the same reason - crushing carbon tubes.
I don't have a torque wrench and I don't trust myself to avoid over-tightening the stem clamp. It probably would've snapped in half when I crashed into the mtb twat the day after the swap.. still need to swap that headset.. 1" threadless Chris King anyone?

You heathens.

Best tools I ever bought was a pair of torque wrenches 5-20nm and 19-110nm - I no longer crush, over tighten or under tighten stuff, and guess what ? All those loose BBs, squeaking headsets, bent saddle rails and stripped threads no longer happen !

I never said I don't have a torque wrench, I've just never quite got round to using it, which of course is really stoopid. I've got one, but it's a 1/4" jobby and all my tools/sockets/adaptors are 1/2", or is it 1/2" and eveything else is !/4", ah damn, can't remember. But the point is you're right torque wrenches are a good idea and I should use one.

Don't think that would have solved the carbon to carbon binding problem though and thats what really freaked me out. Anyway I now have a nicely shimmed down USE Alien aero seat post fitted to the Pedal Force which is super lovely and a plastic shim between the post and the seat tube which I'm hoping will prevent binding from occurring again.